Author Topic: location of item in t-vault  (Read 26953 times)

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Offline Gboy

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #15 on: July 06, 2010, 11:29:35 PM »
       Incase of the vault is located inside the tunnel or in a hole burning with use of logs is messy instead I recommend to use a blow torch then put vinegar the heated area and you can easily break the brittle cement with use of chinsel. A small hole is enough to see inside and you can repeat the procedure if you want enlarge the hole so you can get the item inside.
      You can use the dexpan if you have a electric or airtype drill so you can put the chemical inside your drill hole and dexpan can work, unless your type of dexpan application is in the surface of stone or cement only.

   That small blowtorch is useless in actual portion of concrete demolishing....when we were amateur THr we always bring along a blowtorch, a gallon of vineger and chisel... hoping that it can demolish a portion of concrete.
    When we tried it in a portion of concrete....it took us maybe 2 hours to chips a portion of concrete using blowtorch, splash vinegar and chisel......while a neighbor carpenter using only a chisel/hammer, he was able to chiseled same amount of concrete at 15 minutes time !!!.....hahaha....
    We realized that we were just a fool bringing along that blowtorch hoping that it would make our work faster. The carpenter is laughing at us, why we do that kind of chiseling using useless blowtorch. He told us, we make the work difficult and cumbersome, instead of simple work.

(Para pala kami mga gago nun dala ang suplete sa mga sites, wala palang silbe. mas mabilis pa ang panday magchisel na di gamit ang suplete...pinagtatawanan nga kami ng panday eh, napakasimple magsinsil...pero kaming mga THr pasuplete2 pa at pinapahirapan pa sarili.....nagmukha kami tuloy tanga)  ;D ;D
 

Angel_09

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2010, 12:00:55 AM »
Gentlemen,

I have 2 solutions regarding the breaking of concrete vault. These solutions is applicable if it is on the surface, not inside the tunnel or cave, However, improvising might be able to do it inside.

Legend in the drawing:

F1 = FORCE 1

F2 = FORCE 2

W1 = WEDGE 1

S1 = SUPPORT 1

S2 = SUPPORT 2

These drawings are only the basic idea on how it should be done, and can be expounded depends upon the imagination of the user.  And if everybody believes that there are 'gold' inside the concrete vault, this is the easiest and simpliest method in retrieving it.

Angel

Offline Janner

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2010, 01:19:00 AM »
Post #6 By Gboy,

thats the way the Egyptians broke the stones for the pyramids etc....worked for them !!!


Offline Gener

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2010, 01:31:33 AM »
Honestly,,,Burning a log is the cheapest and it actually earned profit if you are fast enough collecting charcoal...
Burning it straight 3 days will make that concrete or stone brittle or even powdery and you can disludge big chunks of it...Method of doing it is easy but you can consult a charcoal-maker as they have better ideas....

Offline gold_digger

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2010, 02:35:32 AM »
spica


the last time i inquired thru phone to the supplier of bristar and dexpan in manila he said its not available but instead he recomended betonit or betomit i forgot the name, same price w/ bristar and dexpan 3000 per 5kls and he asked some requirements to bring b4 you can buy that chem, here in davao the price about 300x compared to manila but no requirements asked if you bought.   we tried to used dexpan given to us from a friend in US. our target is a big boulder we tried to used electric drill to make a hole  but the boulder was very hard to penetrate, then i tried what miners used from agusan sur they called it bareta,  mano mano but for me very effective compare to electric drill  coz less than 3 hrs bareta can make a hole almost 2ft. then after making holes  we followed what is written in the instructions at the back of packaging of dexpan it says there that with in 24 hrs the boulder will crack like what was shown in their website. we wait for 4 days b4 the boulder start to crack and after 6 days the boulder completely separated into 4 pcs.

i think using fire is not always useful in demolishing concrete vault specially if made by japs, if you read from other forums like ming some posts there said that some chemicals used by japs in their vaults that when heated the concrete will become more hard to penerate. i dont have experienced on this i think it is possible.   

DINDO BAYAUA

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2010, 02:42:42 AM »
Bro, it's called Betonamit cement cracking agent. Very effective too. It is already here in the Phil?
« Last Edit: July 07, 2010, 02:44:15 AM by DINDO BAYAUA »

Offline gold_digger

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2010, 02:55:20 AM »
Bro, it's called Betonamit cement cracking agent. Very effective too. It is already here in the Phil?


thank you bro for your correction. according to the supplier from manila its available now. the address and tel no. i left it in my drawer at the office.  
« Last Edit: November 04, 2010, 04:08:48 AM by DINDO BAYAUA »

Offline Gener

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2010, 02:58:32 AM »
I dont believe much on that,,,Fire can damage anything related to rocks or cement or even metal..if it was mixed with chemicals then it will be much easier to burn as any chemicals will react with enormous amount of heat...The only problem with fire is when the vault is submerged in water...boiling water cannot surely brake that concrete...

Offline cap miwa

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #23 on: July 20, 2010, 05:59:43 AM »
The problem with betonamit, bristar or dexpan is that you need to carry a 32mm drill and a genset to power the drill to where ever that cement or rock is located. If the location is remote or on a steep place, you'll have so much difficulty carrying the genset. We have this liquid chemical, pour it on the concrete, let it sip or penetrate for awhile making the cement brittle and then apply lesser force with a sledge hammer to break it.

Offline ghost

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #24 on: August 06, 2010, 12:58:07 AM »
Cap Miwa, can you share us the name of that liquid chemical?

Offline fom1113

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #25 on: October 04, 2010, 08:12:59 PM »

it is a great idea sir, our plan is to bring welding torch but it is so expensive for us. sir can you please tell me where to buy that portable blow torch?

thanks,
fom1113
Failures made them perfect yet perfect are generous to make themselves masters of their knowledge!

Offline fom1113

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2010, 09:01:02 PM »
 Thank for your posts here sirs,you have great ideas. we will go back to the site where we found a vault lying 5ft below the ground level a year ago. we will talk to lot owner and we will try the blow torch technique because its so hard like metal and we don't have budget for silent demolition chemicals. the place is near the marble quarry that made us safe to use dynamite. we used it 4 times but it was still intact and leaving only small scratches.

fom1113
Failures made them perfect yet perfect are generous to make themselves masters of their knowledge!

Angel_09

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #27 on: October 04, 2010, 10:10:51 PM »
Fom1113,

Here is my suggestion regarding your vault:

First, chip or get a piece of your vault for analysis, to identify what type of adhesive / cohesive agent they use. Knowing it, you'll be able to find the type of destructing agent to demolish it. Without doing it you will just be doing trial and error, banking on the premises that 'later on' it will break away...but you will not know when.
Your worst enemy is time, the longer it will take the more you wil be 'burned out'.

t_hunter44

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #28 on: October 04, 2010, 10:21:50 PM »
Thank for your posts here sirs,you have great ideas. we will go back to the site where we found a vault lying 5ft below the ground level a year ago. we will talk to lot owner and we will try the blow torch technique because its so hard like metal and we don't have budget for silent demolition chemicals. the place is near the marble quarry that made us safe to use dynamite. we used it 4 times but it was still intact and leaving only small scratches.

fom1113
    If one just places the dynamite on top of the object to be broken or demolished and detonate it, sure, it will just scratch or ding it. You need to drill a hole,  stuff in your dynamite and cap it. Be better to use plastic explosive like the C4. Slightly more expensive but has 1.34 more power.  And please do not blow yourself up,be sure you observe all safeties and know what you are doing. Just my 2 cents worth.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2010, 10:27:12 PM by t_hunter44 »

Offline Janner

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Re: location of item in t-vault
« Reply #29 on: October 04, 2010, 10:40:46 PM »
Imagine how the Egyptians cracked those huge rocks 5000 yrs ago,
using only fire and water and a few wedges............. ;)