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21
What is it? / Re: ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by renantiur on January 25, 2017, 08:36:15 PM »

sorry for the misconception that i have posted sir zobex. i stand corrected.

i do believe also that the lab reported posted by king was totally fake. in fact, my friend emailed them and the lab confirmed it was a dubious assay report.
22
What is it? / Re: ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by ZOBEX on January 25, 2017, 03:27:48 PM »
quantitative results are not measured in terms of grams but by purity .   for example, 10% au, 50% silver, aluminum 30% and 10% lead. it is not by grams.

moreover, the sample was indicated as 3.8 grams , and the total result of the grams for the result (au, pt, etc) was 4.171grams. how come these data did not add up?

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Actually QUANTITATIVE means Quantity as in grams while QUALITATIVE means in Quality as in purity or how good it is.  The quality of the item.  An assayer does not have to be certified or licensed other than having a business license, if the assayer does it for profit.  A Certified Laboratory has to be licensed and meet some set of standards of proof of ability to do what they claim.  A certified laboratory can issue a declaration of testing and found results based upon using a set of regulated industry standards they are proven to be able to meet and declare they have done so.

I personally have been an assayer since 1981 and back then specialized in complex metallic ore's such as sulfides and in particular tellurium complex ore's.  No, I am not now or ever been licensed as a business other than for profit.  There is no certification for assayer's.  But I do have a degree in Chemistry.

Depending on how an analysis is performed, it IS possible to have the total resultant weight greater than the testing sample, IF it is a complexing analysis.  Say the gold is a mining sample of a button from a melt down.  That will contain copper, iron, nickle, silver and platinum as well as other possibilities.  One way to do the wet chemical separation is by precipitating out the various components with a salt.  For example, gold is pulled out as gold chloride, silver is pulled out as silver chloride and so on.  Since the way of making the precipitate come out is by making the dissolved gold fall out by combining with chlorine, the combined weight of the gold chloride is greater than the gold alone.  Same for the other elements.  If the weighing is done on the gold chloride and others, the combined weight will be greater than the initial sample.  But knowing the molecular weight of gold chloride and of gold element, one can back calculate the net weight of the gold alone.  But for mining purposes the lab tech would only look for what is requested and if you ask for only the precious metals then that is what he will pull out.  So the resulting numbers is what you ask for, not everything that is there at the start.

All depends how the testing laboratory does it.  But in this case I suspect the report you posted is just that, a bulllshit report.

Just so you know.

Z
23
What is it? / Re: ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by renantiur on January 25, 2017, 02:40:37 PM »

Dear Mr ____ (my friend),

It is true that the report is fake. In fact CSAL INC has moved out of Tucson in 2006 to Prescott. The logo, letter head, name of the Lab ( Complete Analytical Services ), address, phone numbers, area code of phone numbers and many things are wrong.

Thank you for informing us. Have a good day.

Mr. D.A. Shah / Director
CSALINC
24
What is it? / Re: ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by renantiur on January 24, 2017, 03:22:36 PM »


yes sir tony. we have the same observation. i cannot see any 100% result there in terms of quantitative test results.
25
What is it? / Re: ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by admin on January 24, 2017, 09:47:14 AM »
Yes. I know that. I can't see any 100% of purity there. What's exactly what I was referring to.
TW


quantitative results are not measured in terms of grams but by purity .   for example, 10% au, 50% silver, aluminum 30% and 10% lead. it is not by grams.

moreover, the sample was indicated as 3.8 grams , and the total result of the grams for the result (au, pt, etc) was 4.171grams. how come these data did not add up?


the logo of CSA is not the correct logo of copper state analytical lab.  the address is also not the same, as well as the contact numbers.

it seems to me that D. A. Shah was correctly spelled .

but the caption "in business since 1958" does not also jive with their website. their website claims they are " operating since 1981".

if anybody of you knows copper state analytical lab, they are just one email away.

thanks.
26
What is it? / Re: ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by renantiur on January 22, 2017, 05:59:20 PM »


quantitative results are not measured in terms of grams but by purity .   for example, 10% au, 50% silver, aluminum 30% and 10% lead. it is not by grams.

moreover, the sample was indicated as 3.8 grams , and the total result of the grams for the result (au, pt, etc) was 4.171grams. how come these data did not add up?


the logo of CSA is not the correct logo of copper state analytical lab.  the address is also not the same, as well as the contact numbers.

it seems to me that D. A. Shah was correctly spelled .

but the caption "in business since 1958" does not also jive with their website. their website claims they are " operating since 1981".

if anybody of you knows copper state analytical lab, they are just one email away.

thanks.
27
What is it? / Re: ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by admin on January 22, 2017, 12:48:07 AM »
Do all of those numbers add up to 100%? I'm trying to figure it out...
TW
28
What is it? / ASSAY RESULT...
« Last post by KING on January 21, 2017, 09:57:53 PM »
Try to look...
29
my prospective shipwreck project investors are completely turned off and don't want to have anything to do with pursuing shipwrecks in the Philippines. Sucks!
TW



Maybe its to create a new crew sir.
Im sure many here loves to explore our sea bed.  Specially with an additional purpose like we do. 8) ;D

Y

Well TW, perhaps they don't want to be framed up by crooked PNP of the new president.  Besides the Korean, there is the just recent frame up at NAIA.  I remember when the crooked NAIA murdered a ethnic Filipino American Citizen a Lt. Commander in the USN.  First framed him on phony drug charge and when the US Embassy came over, they tossed him off of a set of cement stairs and broke his neck.  If you like I can post his picture and a picture of the cement steps he was tossed off of.

Let's see, it was crooked cops from the new presidential anti drug task force from Camp Crame that raided the innocent man's home with a fake search warrant for non existent firearms.  Then kidnapped him and shoved him in a van and told his wife they found drugs in his house, no fire arms.  Then took him to Camp Crame the PNP HQ.  While at Camp Crame and inside Camp Crame wrapped his head up with duct tame to suffocate him, while still in handcuffs to kill him off.  Now mind you the place he as assassinated at is only 40 meters across the floor from the office of the New Director of national police, the presidents right hand goon from Davao City.  Hmmmm.  Now the murdered man with his head wrapped in duct tape is removed from Camp Crame again about 40 meters from the Directors office and taken to a crematorium owned by an alleged that is, former member of the Anti Drug Task Force.  Now why would an asset and field agent for the Anti Drug Task Force need a funeral parlor and crematorium to incinerate bodies.  Well after paying a large cash bribe for the now dead husband, the wife demands to see proof of life before paying more.  No proof, he is already burned up, so she contacts the NBI.  Hmmmm.  Some how the owner of the crematorium gets tipped off by Camp Crame and he flushes the ashes down the toilet and immediately runs to NAIA and takes a flight to CANADA, getting out of the country just before the NBI try to grab him.  Naturally there is more but - - - - -.

I am very familiar with the top floor of Camp Crame, while other Filipinos were out grubbing on the street, back 10-15 years ago I had a Nation Wide Security Agency license issued out of Camp Crame and spent about 3 days a week going to the top floor of the building.  I know the exact layout of the offices and rooms.  Can also tell you it must be very embarrassing for the top of the administration to keep a house boy in a white jacket busy with buckets of water flushing the toilets because back then there was no working plumbing even at the top floor.  We always wondered about that.  Yes I had that license, it was controversial to be said.

So I kind of doubt there will be a lot of investors lining up to gamble on getting anything there.





So TW I kind of doubt you will get any foreign investors to put money in the PH.

30
Shipwrecks & Sunken Treasure / Heritage adrift
« Last post by admin on January 20, 2017, 10:56:20 AM »
Heritage adrift
http://www.insideindonesia.org/heritage-adrift / Jan. 2017

Natali Pearson

Thirty years since the Geldermalsen cargo was sold off, Indonesia’s underwater cultural heritage legislation remains inconsistent and ambiguous, with serious implications for its many shipwrecks.

The Indonesian archipelago is the final resting place for at least 400 known shipwrecks. The diverse wrecks constitute a snapshot of Indonesia’s rich histories: ancient dhows that plied the maritime ceramic route between the Middle East and China, Dutch East Indiamen laden with tea and spices, watery World War II graves, and crowded ferry disasters of the present day. Scholars speculate that many more remain undiscovered, or at least unreported.

Indonesia’s underwater cultural heritage has not received the same attention as land-based heritage sites such as Borobudur and Prambanan, despite the variety and historical significance of many of these wrecks. At best, shipwrecks are considered to be commercial excavation opportunities or diving sites; at worst, they are places for amateur souveniring or semi-professional salvaging.

Yet Indonesia is aware of the significance of its underwater cultural heritage – and the inadequacy of its legislative framework – for at least three decades.

The £10 million teapot

One of the most prominent examples of the destruction of Indonesia’s underwater cultural heritage was the 1986 auction of objects removed from the Geldermalsen wreck. The Geldermalsen was a Dutch East India Trading Company cargo vessel that sank near Riau, south of Singapore, in 1752. In the mid-1980s, British treasure hunter Michael Hatcher salvaged the vessel for profit, saving only valuable objects and destroying what was left. Although Hatcher had a contract with the Dutch Government to excavate the wreck, it is clear that there were other interests deserving of attention. In his own words, ‘…it was a race to get what [we] could before being interrupted by weather, rivals, pirates, or some government.’

The salvage process has been likened to swimming in a gigantic teapot. The Geldermalsen’s most precious cargo, at least at the time of its sinking, was not gold and porcelain, but tea. In 1986, the salvaged porcelain and gold was auctioned by Christie’s in Amsterdam for more than £10 million.

Notably, it was auctioned as the ‘Nanking’ cargo, even though the wreck was in Indonesian waters. Furthermore, Indonesia received nothing from the sale proceeds.

Protecting treasure by selling it

Hatcher’s actions revealed the vacuum that existed in relation to the ownership and management of underwater cultural heritage in Indonesia. As a result, legislation was introduced in 1989 that formalised state ownership of all wrecks in Indonesian waters. It also established the National Committee for Salvage and Utilisation of Valuable Cargo Objects from Sunken Ships (PanNas BMKT), which was authorised to issue commercial excavation permits to third parties through an Indonesian licensee. The consequence of this legislation was that ships and their cargoes were constituted primarily as economic, rather than historical, resources – resources that now belonged to the state.

In 1992, Indonesia introduced new cultural heritage legislation (Law No. 5/1992). It provided for objects of historical and cultural significance, but did not directly address the issue of underwater sites and objects. This law did not replace the 1989 legislation, but operated alongside it.

It is within this context that numerous wrecks were excavated by companies such as Seabed Explorations. Some, such as the fifteenth century Bakau wreck, were already extensively looted at the time of excavation. Others, however, such as the Belitung (Tang) wreck, have yielded numerous commercially-valuable objects. This ninth century ship, which was carrying thousands of Tang dynasty ceramics, is believed to have sunk on its return journey to the Middle East. The cargo was excavated by Seabed Explorations, and, after conservation, sold to Singapore for US$32 million. Select objects are on permanent display at the Asian Civilisations Museum.
Valuing the past

However, the activities of Seabed Explorations and other such commercial excavation companies operating in Indonesia are currently on hold. In 2010, the same year as new heritage legislation (Act No. 11/2010) was introduced, Indonesia placed a five-year moratorium on the issuing of all new licences to commercial excavation companies. Legislative revisions have not yet passed, even though the time limit on this moratorium has lapsed. This delay can be attributed to differences of opinion within the Indonesian government about the management of underwater cultural heritage.

A commitment to the protection and preservation of these sites could be achieved by signing the 2001 UNESCO Convention on the Protection of the Underwater Cultural Heritage. The Convention preferences in situ preservation of wrecks, and bans commercial excavation. However, it is unlikely that Indonesia will consider this as an option, due to the resource burden it places on countries.

It is more likely that Indonesia will manage its underwater cultural heritage through the introduction, or revision, of domestic legislation. The ongoing legislative delays point to an unresolved tension within Indonesia about how its underwater cultural heritage should be valued – as a resource for exploitation, or as a cultural legacy worth protecting and preserving. 

Natali Pearson (natali.pearson@sydney.edu.au) is completing a PhD at the University of Sydney on the ethics of cultural heritage in Indonesia. She is co-editor of a blog on Southeast Asian heritage, histories and historiographies, (http://SEAsiaPasts.com).

Inside Indonesia 125: Jul-Sep 2016

PHOTO 1: Stacks of Changsha bowls in-situ, 1999 - Credit: Michael Flecker
PHOTO 2: A small spouted jar containing star anise, 1999 - Credit: Michael Flecker
PHOTO 3: Poor visibility limits clear photos of HMAS Perth., 2014 - Credit: Shinatria Adhityatama / Pusat Arkaeologi Nasional (Arkenas)
PHOTO 4: The Tang Shipwreck Collection on display at the Asian Civilisations Museum, 2015 - Credit: Asian Civilisations Museum
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